Sealing the line set prevents moisture from getting in. Really? I have had the same type of failure many times and I only test in the shop at 100 psi. Thank you for providing this platform and all your great YTvideos. Somethings not right. It is possible that the same principle may apply to copper line sets. The location of a vent can help equalize the siphoning effects of pressurization. x 35 ft. Standard Line Set, JMF EZ-Pull 3/8 x 3/4 in. Anything with a higher pH, like soap or bleach, is basic. These lines were manufactured in 2014, 15, and 16. According to the customer, the system is less than five years old. So far it is 8 different 164' rolls that had leaks. Sign up to receive email about product launches, events, deals & more! Then, you just sit back and watch for bubbles to form. Multi zone? Cleanouts and vents may be confused for each other, but cleanouts allow the technician to access and clean the drain. The yellow stickers recommend Polyken-936-30 tape. However, the adhesive isnt usually strong enough to stop moisture and air from coming in. Although there isnt much definitive information on the causes of these issues, weve still noticed some trends that can help us understand and repair line set corrosion. Neil likes to slit the insulation jacket and run an electronic leak detector over the opening. Terms of Site Use| That way, moisturecan't interact with the insulation and form acid inside. or other leak detection fluid. 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Mild acids irritate your tongue at least a little bit, so you could probably imagine the damage that acids could inflict on copper. (They corrode within months, if not straight out of the box.). I havent noticed this correlation, but its interesting. By that I mean the tubing and not the connections. Mueller, a different manufacturer, doesnt appear to have these corrosion problems to NEARLY the same degree as Isoclima. Makes at least 3 for us. The insulation ratings also need to be appropriate. Real training for HVAC ( Heating, Ventilation, Air Conditioning and Refrigeration) Technicians. something else to look foward to in the ac buisness. Ive spoken with a few people and they stated the manufacturer said its because of the chemical they use to make the insulation UV resistant, it reacts with water and air and creates pin holes on the pipe. Little more expensive than the standard line sets but it seems to me to be the solution to all corrosion problems. Please DONT treat this article as a definitive source of information. WASHINGTON On the day he seriously thought never would arrive as late as this past November, England coach Stuart Lancaster hails Henry, Cardiff City can still win promotion to the Premier League despite their slow start to the season, new manager Russell. With superior services, our premiere loyalty program and cutting-edge technology solutions, we provide you with what you need in order to set your business apart from others. Overall, best practices include using proper grommets and ensuring that you have a solid connection. I have over 9,000' of this stuff out there. Of course, your first step is to do leak tests around the obvious places, like connections and flare fittings, but you find nothing. We started insulating our own copper, and now I guess there is some new black pre-insulated copper that we are using. of leaky areas if you open the insulation and see green spots. Do not run high voltage wiring in parallel with low-voltage or control wiring. The wires should be appropriately sized, have an appropriate level of tension, and should not be vulnerable to chafing or abrasion. Electronic leak detectors can usually pick up those tiny leaks from the pinholes. Cleanouts are also capped when in use, but vents are not. They sent me a current copy of the line set manufacturers installation instructions where in it was "recommended" to seal the ends of the insulation to the copper. Born in 1900, Roxanna Slade recounts how the events of two World Wars, the racial division of the South, and her own private tragedies combine to change her life forever, Yankees once feared alcohol would kill call-up. Copper Tube Streamline Line Sets have been an industry leader for decades. Something to Watch For When Replacing a Thermostat, Single vs. multiple drains with other appliances, Drain pitch and if there could be too much fall. So far so good. is this copper and insulation you bought separately? Slide insulation over that. If we look a bit at the chemical properties of PE and copper, we might be able to figure out why sealing the line sets at both ends is so important and what it has to do with corrosion. It is possible that the same principle may apply to copper line sets. The coil energizes, creating an electromagnet. In this video, Brad demonstrates that using a cap off of a refrigerant tank on a system can depress the Schrader core on the system in some cases. I've personally rolled out thousands of feet of these Linsets and plenty are leaking. Removed the white outer insulation at the condenser flares to find black brown copper. However, one undebatable fact is that various line set manufacturers have starkly different rates of corrosion. x 50 ft. Mini-Split Line Set, JMF EZ-Pull 3/8 x 7/8 in. However, one undebatable fact is that various line set manufacturers have starkly different rates of corrosion. I wish he would just say what manufacture it is Nice video Gary. So, you have a clear idea of what an acidic substance is. Armacell has put out a technical bulletin concerning this issue. Fittings I really like that coated insulation does not seem to be effected to uv deteration like armoflex and handle weather exposure a lot better over time peace n good luck clammy. When I found your theory I went back and looked at some of the pictures I took when I disassembled the unit. Coated elastomeric insulation utilizes a co-extruded jacket that request no additional cover or coating. Some just take the job for the money and worry bout the rest later or until it becomes a issue . http://www.blodgettsupply.com/data/Unsorted/Armacell_USTechBulletin_Tubolit_WLS_CUI_111218_WLS001-81719-1.pdf. The purpose of this section is NOT to disparage or endorse any manufacturers. Haven't had any leaks. If possible, you may want to consider replacing corroded line sets with new ones and using black elastomeric insulation instead of the white PE-type. On the surface, I think we all understand how a solenoid valve works. Serving Northern Maine HVAC & Controls. DISCLAIMER: A lot of the information in this article is based on field experience and does not appear to have a peer-reviewed scientific basis. and we are having some bad issues with them, too. We had since then had this issue repeat on 2 different projects. Thanks, guys! x 25 ft. Standard Line Set, JMF EZ-Pull 3/8 x 3/4 in. Thats the problem. All rights reserved. Peace and good luck clammy. On the low-voltage side, you also need to be careful of where you route your wires to avoid induction, contact with hot surfaces, or abrasion. I would just go back to using armaflex it's more work but if it's going to Crate pinhole leaks in the line set that's a no-go. https://photos.app.goo.gl/mEBBIlxX1JEc77hu2, CF3D076A-3ADA-4912-8AF0-D6C75F2826B1.jpeg. StreamlineLine Sets are available in lengths from 10 to 100 with various custom options and connections to meet every need, Heating Ventilation Air Conditioning & Refrigeration. When Neil Comparetto did some investigation, he discovered that Isoclima/Isopolar line sets also had many technician reports of corrosion. x 30 ft. Mini-Split Line Set, 1/4 x 1/2 in. Brian is also the owner of Chadwick Air, and Neil is a co-owner of Comparetto Comfort Solutions and a longtime contributor to HVAC School. However, moisture alone doesnt cause corrosion to the degrees that technicians have been seeing. x 25 ft. Mini-Split Line Set, 1/4 x 3/8 in. Although oxygen can pass through pure polyethylene quite easily, moisture cannot. of the insulation with caulk or sealant to prevent moisture from coming in. not a vrf fan. Looks like the same stuff as the white ones, just black. Again, I should mention that this next practice is only based on personal experience and doesnt have a scientific basis. Price Lists But that's about it. x 40 ft. Standard Line Set, JMF EZ-Pull 3/8 x 3/4 in. In other words, these corroded tubes arent ancient, so we wouldn't expect them to have leaks and corrosion. CAD/BIM, Lead-Free Compliance Copper Tube and Fittings, Standard and Mini Split Line Sets for HVACR Applications Submittal, Streamline Line Sets Duraguard UV/PE Comparison Guide, Streamline Line Sets Part Number Coding Guide, Streamline Standard and Mini Split Line Sets. i would stop buying those linsets and make sure i'm getting full thickness tubing. I have been reported of few new black rubber elastomeric line sets failures by the local contractors community and so I gave credit to the ISOTECH product. Copper cannot corrode without oxygen and moisture. The manufacture agreed to replace the unit. I thought I was going crazy as put gauges to troubleshoot a 14 month old 3 zone that was flat. The first clue is right on the box. Shrub we had two leakers thus far. Pulled first 35 ft on shortest zone only to find pin holes every where. And I believe the wall thickness is much thinner. Had another leaking line today, not at the connections but pin holes through the tubing. i cant imagine how air and moisture will penetrate insualtion. migrate and cause pinhole leaks THROUGH the copper. CAPrivacyRights| Are they are White vertical Lines - LG UltraGear 27GN800-B. Why would we need to seal both ends of a line set? I have been using a coated copper pipe (ISOTECH) that seems to work well as the metal is now isolated from the external environment. How much PRESSURE is that Recovery Tank Designed For? For now, it might just be worth your while to get your hands on a high-quality caulk or give the elastomeric black insulation a try. Basically, dry contacts are switches with no shared [], 2021 - HVAC School | All rights reserved, This article includes significant contributions from Neil Comparetto and Brian Chadwick, both of whom are HVAC technicians in Virginia. When you do a bubble test on the copper, you see bunches of microbubbles. Thats exactly what Im worried about, I have jobs with hundreds of feet of this stuff. Most of the PE-insulated line sets seem to have fundamental issues. way of knowing what the insulation contains and if it is responsible for the corrosion or not. Remember, thats why the manufacturers recommend sealing both ends; its to cut off moistures access points. I try to fatten myself up, but my metabolism disagrees. Nah these are line sets Im buying separately. Find a Rep There seems to be a problem completing the request at present. 3 acts, 7 scenes, 2 men, 4 women, 1 interior. x 50 ft. Standard Line Set, 1/4 x 3/8 in. , VOCs contribute to formicary corrosion in copper evaporator coils in tight, poorly ventilated homes. Seems a bit strange, right? It is regular ACR soft copper with continuous white insulation. I burn wood, it smells good! Whats happening brother. 638 here myself. We have hundreds of locations nationwide, ready to meet your needs. Insulation is choice of elastomeric or coated elastomeric material. its bullshit and alot of clients are having to pay for their fuck ups. Submittals So, why is it so common? what is interesting is that all problems were exterior to the building and on the High pressure (thinner line) side of the system. Second After an hour was down to 450PSI and had a slow leak. Browse Ferguson's job categories, organized by industry, to find professional-grade equipment, tools and parts for a wide range of projects. I am assuming the tubing is leaking and not at any joints?? I have just a few systems in using said insulated piping but I have noticed one manafactures states on the box that its 10 year warranty against leaks or failure of tubing what ever the legally means .never saw that on any piece of any type of copper tubing acr or whatever that I have ever purchased .on another note where all the leaks concerned on longer line set lengths usually Im getting 50 to 100 ft line sets .i guess every business needs return business weather good or bad .i have only seen that on mini split line sets a few guys I work for use pre insulated sets for there ref lines I see no warranty statement on them but I will say the annealing on the tubing sucks very brittle I complain every time I do a set w this junk personally I either use straight hard or rolls of uninsulated acr and use 1/2 wall armoflex to insulate but never a kink . that some line set manufacturers white PE insulation reacts with moisture to create an acidic environment around the copper line set. Perhaps you didnt question it at all, or maybe you havent come across it. I don't know the brand but they gave the installers and owners fits.

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